Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

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jmann
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby jmann » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:05 am

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:58 am

Jmann - Nothing but hard work and plenty of hours mate - thanks for your encouragement.
Here you can see me building the new flange design
Image
I glued everything together with hot melt glue then reinforced it with bondo
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First coat of spray putty. You can see the new flanges are now twice the size. This will make things easier later on. The new flat flange area will be where the vacuum bag seals will go.
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This is about as "kiska" as I am game to go :?
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I listened to peoples comments so this is certainly more angular than the first design. I just hope it will look ok when finished. I will have to redesign all the mounts again as this one is different enough to warrant it.
I still have to coat it in 2 pack hard clear and sand all over again then make the mold out of fiberglass.
Have to stop for awhile as work is getting in the way.
More later
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:50 am

A quick note to anyone mad enough to go through this process - dont rush or you will pay the price and it will cost you time and money :oops:
I quickly sprayed the 2 pack clear coat whilst the humidity was high (raining) and decided that instead of slowly building up the layers and giving it a quick sand between coats I would lay the stuff on thick and just sand it back until I had a flat clear surface.
Not a good idea - the thick clear reacted with the spray putty and turned into a mess of extreme orange peel and the worst part is that it has distorted the surfaces whilst drying. This clear coat dries super hard so I had to sand everything back with course sand paper until it was all gone and I had my flat surfaces back - this little feck up has cost me about a weeks work - am I an idiot - you bet :roll:
Image
This is the mess I am left with at present and I will have to fill the imperfections again and start the putty and clear coats all over again. What a waste of time and effort. Be warned if you ever bother to follow these instructions - pay attention to keeping the clear coats thin and sand between coats :cry:
I should have known better............
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HYPERMOTO
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby HYPERMOTO » Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:48 pm

I know nothing about GRP Mould Making but I do know paint and I have to say that spray putty is terrible stuff.
It is not really that compatible with 2K products especially when sandwiched between them.
If you need it to build up the thickness to sand flat then you would be better off using a decent 2K High Build Primer of 4:1 mix ratio and put it on heavy.
This will build really well, give a good stable base and work perfectly under your final clearcoats.
Looking great bud, keep at it :wink:
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Thu Jan 28, 2016 11:06 am

Good one HYPER, I appreciate you expertise. Sometimes there are too many choices and its a bit confusing for someone not in that industry!
I do have to be very careful with anything that has thinners at 4:1 because the stuff loves to eat the expanding foam and I can't risk that at this stage :oops: chemical blob on shed floor :shock:
Looks like I will be back to testing material compatibility before proceeding when I have the time to get back on the job. Never stop learning with this stuff.
To make things even more difficult I have decided to try vacuum infusion methods for the final CF layup this time. I have found an old vacuum pump that I will rebuild and get working and then I have to build a vacuum catch pot and order the resins and other materials specific to vac infusion. Risky business but I have my fingers crossed.
Thanks mate.
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby HYPERMOTO » Thu Jan 28, 2016 10:18 pm

No worries abc, you're doing a grand job 8)
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:00 am

I have been busy building a catch can for the vacuum infusion of the final carbon lay up so I havent had much time to work on the plug.This thing is designed to catch any excess resin before it gets to the vacuum pump and fecks it up :(
The plastic cup inside allows me to remove it once it is partially filled with excess resin. Should work good.
Next is to fix the old worn out vacuum pump and plumb everything together then leak test.
Here is a pic of the catch can.
Image
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby Jacko » Fri Feb 26, 2016 2:58 pm

Eeeeeeeeeeeeekkkk!

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby Silverbear » Sat Feb 27, 2016 1:29 am

I have been following your thread with interest and I feel your pain when things go pear shaped.Had the same problem as you when making a mould for my custom subframe body work.If ever I need putty spray,I now go to my local NRMA panel shop and get them to pray on the proper 2pack stuff for me.They spray on the final matte black finish any way and they charge me bugger all.It shits me as it probably does you that you have to rely on someone else and fork out cash to do something,but sometimes it's the best and cheaper way.Keep up the great work and hopefully encourage others to make there own stuff.Cheers.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Sat Feb 27, 2016 11:12 am

Thanks silver bear,
I have spoken with a local painter already but I don't like relying on anyone and the problem is not the 2 pack but the foam plug body underneath and the thin layer of bondo. The mistake I made was not applying a thick enough layer of bondo and everything post that step has been a problem. Of course trying to keep all those nice sharp edges and not break through the clear and bondo has driven me mad.
Anyway it's all good now and I have continued with the floor 2 pack clear because it doesn't effect the base layers like the automotive 2 pack. The reasons remain unclear to me and my local painter :?
Anyway I'm close to being ready to make the mould and have taken all the surfaces all the way down to 1500 wet and dry and polished. I'm now coating the plug in 10 plus layers of carnauba wax release agent.
I am slowly making progress and building my knowledge base.
Looks like I will rebuild the pump at night this week and layup the mould next week if all goes to plan :D
Then all I have to do is study and understand all the vacuum infusion sh1t for when it's carbon fibre lay up time:?
Thanks for your encouragement mate.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:39 am

Vacuum pump repaired and new Orings fitted. Shown here pumping down and leak testing assembly. All looks ok so far.
Image
The drill bit sticking up is acting like a plug for testing purposes and this port will go to the carbon fibre layup and draw the resin into the carbon.
The catch pot will catch any excess resin and protect the pump.
Now its back to final polishing and waxing of the plug so i can start to make the molds.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Wed Mar 02, 2016 8:09 am

Plug sanded all the way to 1500 grit and polished. Then 12 coats of wax to help with mold release. Big job this part and glad to see the end of it.
Image
Next is to seal the split line with clay then spray it with PVA thinned with alcohol. Do 2 coats of that then 2 thick coats of gelcoat and I'm good to go.
Finally I will be making a mold of this design version very soon - yay.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:28 am

sprayed 6 mist coats of PVA to help mold release.
Image
Gelcoat tomorrow.
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby grommet » Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:36 am

Liking it.

So, once it's done - how much, and will you be shipping to the US?

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:23 pm

Mold
Image
The plug bonded to the mold surface in a few spots so I have to fix that and reinforce the flanges.
Image
The Gelcoat had left a streaky finish on the surface so I have more sanding and polishing to do but its not too bad.
Image
The poor old plug needs a good trip to the hospital and Im amazed it survived :(
More later once everything is fixed and ready to go.
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby Mr_Trecolareco » Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:32 am

:shock:

Congrats for the work so far and not settling for the V1.1

This V2 looks much better.

Have you ever thought about trying the the matte "dry carbon" look ?
Image
Um abraco e mto boas curvas!! :)
Image

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Tue Mar 08, 2016 3:46 am

Thanks mate.
The final carbon bellypan will have the matte carbon look same as in your picture. Unfortunately to achieve that look still requires polished mold surfaces. Matte carbon is basically the shinny stuff that has been rubbed back with wet or dry paper, so in the end it is more work but the molds still need to be pretty good otherwise the final finish looks uneven and cheap. Also part of the reason for polished surfaces is to ensure the mold releases, the resins love any little imperfections and will attempt to grab hold anywhere they can. This plug even stuck to the mold in a few places even after all the extra work I put into it to ensure everything would release OK. The whole process is crazy labour intensive!
I dont like the shiny carbon look so I will be making the extra effort to bring my V2 bellypan to the matte look.
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby MishMash » Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:24 pm

well done excellent work

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Mon Mar 14, 2016 3:29 am

Molds polished to 1500 wet and dry then micro polished and 10 coats of wax added - nearly ready to go
Image
I just hope it is good enough to release the carbon from the mold as there are a lot of negative edges and sharp corners to grab hold of everything.
Image
Materials for vacuum infusion ordered and just waiting for everything to arrive.
More later.
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:27 am

Good news - it now looks like I will be able to lay the carbon in one continuous form and dont need to cut any of the fabric. No joins in the final product is excellent news as I though I would have to start chopping the carbon into sections to get in to comply with the mold.
This is the advantage of using the 2x2 twill weave carbon and having the split plug design so I can use it all together to check on the way the carbon mates with all the sharp edges in the mold.
Image
The final bellypan shape will be cut where you see the top edge of the foam plug so all the carbon you see in the pic will eventually be removed and the final bellypan shape will remain.
Being ale to lay it up in one continuous sheet will look heaps better and is a small win for me.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby gotswap » Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:42 pm

Love the progress, keep up the good work and get that assembly line going :)
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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby Jacko » Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:17 pm

Anyone reckon the bellypan/sumpguard type thing on the 1290 GT would look okay on a SD? had a quick look today but couldn't find anyone selling them, perhaps in a few months when the GT has been around a while there may be a few guys selling them at parts

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby abc » Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:46 am

First time layup with vacuum infusion
The carbon was almost impossible to layup in the shape without distorting the weave :(
interesting experiment all this :shock:
Image
I will know in 3 days if it worked :?
Last edited by abc on Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
Any modifications you undertake are your sole responsibility, I am not liable for any claims relating to modifications or suggestions posted on this forum. If you undertake any modifications you do so at your own risk.

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby Dukem » Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:38 am

love this Post and Love you ABC :D

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Re: Building a bellypan/sumpguard for the 1290

Postby kevxtx » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:21 am

Great job. :D

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