How to remap the 1290

[MrZ32]

Thanks for the clarification.

Personally even if this became possible for this bike and I tried it, I'd still prefer to check on the dyno and have the "hardwired" map tweaked by a fuel controller. Plus the added benefit of the fuel controller is the option to have a base map and then have auto-tune make fine adjustments on the fly for air temps, ram air, etc.

So when I get my full Akra exhaust how will the dealer re-map my bike? Have a look at this video specifically the screen at 4:45. It shows adjustments for idle and full load on the dealers tablet. Is this all they will adjust or is there a full map that's flashed to the ECU perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQYx1snHMs4

I think that you are missing the point here of tune ECU, it is a far more powerful a tool than a piggy back fuel controller. If you find a decent dyno operator, they will very successfully remap your bike (both closed and open loops) using tune ecu (including ignition mapping) and with a fly by wire setup, you could even change the throttle response to what you want it to be rather than the lame ramp up that you have to put up with (most of the highly tuned bikes are running quarter turn throttles here for sharper response).

That and a full diagnostics setup that is more powerful that the KTM unit... but sure... stick with your expensive piggy back that is not that powerful...

Tune ECU basically revolutionised what was possible with the SD, including being able to remove emissions crap without fault lights occurring (without having to use resisters etc, you simply told the ecu to stop looking for the removed part).

Plus you can always save the original map on your pc or even after tuning your bike on the dyno, you could run a PCV with an auto tune function (if you really wanted to)

[ktmguy]

Thanks for the clarification.

Personally even if this became possible for this bike and I tried it, I'd still prefer to check on the dyno and have the "hardwired" map tweaked by a fuel controller. Plus the added benefit of the fuel controller is the option to have a base map and then have auto-tune make fine adjustments on the fly for air temps, ram air, etc.

So when I get my full Akra exhaust how will the dealer re-map my bike? Have a look at this video specifically the screen at 4:45. It shows adjustments for idle and full load on the dealers tablet. Is this all they will adjust or is there a full map that's flashed to the ECU perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQYx1snHMs4

I'm pretty sure for the akra they will load a complete new map. The adjustments the chap in the video made are just presale check and country specific.
I helped the local Husky dealer assemble some bikes yesterday. As anyone knows they are KTM (ex husaberg) now. Same for these bikes, they are the same for each country and specifics like the Australian road legal lights wiring harness has to be mounted by the dealer (sits in the box).
In my opinion a lot of KTM dealers come from dirtbike backgound and I see them struggling big time with this setup! If they forget to set something or set it wrongly it will be funny!
A better option is having a file to upload by the dealer specific for the country, saves the dealer going over the menu's to set lights, speedo etc...
Not a friendly system and even the guy in the video was struggling a bit.

[NEO]

Great thread.

As with any new model it takes time to get into the ecu or develop a fuelling module.
We have a contact in the uk that requires a bike for a couple of days to take a look at. The minimum end result will be a Pcv wired in and working.

If any 1290 owners living close to Norfolk in the uk are interested in helping out we will supply you a Pcv for free.

With regards to our exhausts, we ship them in a state safe to run on stock fuelling, they run a little leaner than stock but still safe.
In this state you get around a 5bhp power gain.
We state that once we are able to remap in 1 form or other you will see a significant power gain again.

The KTM Akra full system map when available will work as well with our exhaust as the Akra exhaust, it's a global library map that are notoriously rich running and do an ok job. That is always second place to a custom map in 1 form or other.

We will offer the Pcv, bazzaz or other with a map created for our exhausts as soon as we have them. In the mean time the KTM map will be better than nothing.

[jmann]

My understanding is that KTM intend to use their distribution network for the installation of their map. This means that they plug in the bike, go online, type in the VIN number Etc, and the map will download directly from Austria to the bike It won't be in the hands of the dealers. In this way KTM not only control the software but also the price of the add-ons one can use on the bike. If this is correct it changes the whole game ... It also leaves third party providers and those that want to race out in the cold. This is how the
Adventure MSC retrofit was handled and this is a feature of the diagnostic software that is talked up on their web-site.

If it had support from this forum I'd be prepared to write to KTM on behalf of our members seeking details of how the interface works and how we might be able to modify the bike. The point is that it needs to come from our 3166 members in order for them to take us seriously and provide details.

[ebags]

I'm onboard jmann

[jmann]

I'm onboard jmann

Good. I'm happy for pep's to +1 but I guess I'll wait a few days for any violent dissension. If there is none I'll take that as overall support.

[DMacL]

My understanding is that KTM intend to use their distribution network for the installation of their map. This means that they plug in the bike, go online, type in the VIN number Etc, and the map will download directly from Austria to the bike It won't be in the hands of the dealers. In this way KTM not only control the software but also the price of the add-ons one can use on the bike. If this is correct it changes the whole game ... It also leaves third party providers and those that want to race out in the cold. This is how the
Adventure MSC retrofit was handled and this is a feature of the diagnostic software that is talked up on their web-site.

If it had support from this forum I'd be prepared to write to KTM on behalf of our members seeking details of how the interface works and how we might be able to modify the bike. The point is that it needs to come from our 3166 members in order for them to take us seriously and provide details.

Your understanding tallies with mine. My dealer suggested that KTM not only charges them a monthly fee for the electronic gubbins, on top of the multi-thousand pound purchase price, but that any alterations they make to ECU's are invoiced automatically! So they cannot offer any freebies - apparently it's possible to turn on auto-cancelling indicators on the 1290, but they'd have to charge £20 to cover what KTM will charge them.

So you have my full support, as does anyone able or willing to work on accessing the bike's electronics "unofficially".

[NEO]

Aprilia did this with the full Named exhaust. Then they realised that they could also make money supplying a race ecu ( stock ecu with full system map installed ).
It's the way things now go, a manufacturer gets into bed with an exhaust company to create a monopoly on after market parts! Where this strategy fails is they assume all motorcycle owners are brain dead lemmings only capable of acting on hype shoved on them by the media not capable of making there own purchasing decisions!
Luckily the average bike owner is not sucked in by the above politically driven bs and buys what they want to buy.

An ecu map and fuelling device will come very shortly, I can promise you of that.

[ktmguy]

That story with the MSC for the ADV1190 hecks me off to great extend! Specially since the '14 bike scomes with it standard, all the people who rushed out to buy one got done in the backside. Thanks KTM!
I'm not a lawyer but it feels that in some countries that is actually illegal under the consumer guaranty act
Anyone working to adapt tuneecu or hack in to it has my support even for a donation!
I mentioned before that KTM turns quickly in to the apple of motorbikes.... enough said! Main reason I haven't got one yet! Listening KTM?

[jmann]

An ecu map and fuelling device will come very shortly, I can promise you of that.

Thanks NEO for your general support. I suspect that something like a PC5 might work however I'm not convinced. I'm not convinced that a PC5 will be able to just slip in and directly control the injectors (it might) but it could also be that the Electronic Management Computer will detect a stray device on the network and effectively say "bugger off". I've been told that there is a code required for all updates. Even if it did, what I personally want is direct access to the system not indirect as per PC5 Etc.

The point about this initiative is lobbying. I'm going to say we have 3000+ members that will see the response and probably several bike magazines as well. We are after all, ready to race, but not towards financial insolvency. We are seeking a technical partnership that encourages third party products to enhance the bike.

Actually, just thinking about magazines I guess everyone is aware of what would happen to them if they couldn't raise money by advertising. Imagine for example, what would happen if all they could write about is the bikes (on loan from a few manufacturers) rather than about the performance products and bling. They'd be stuffed. Essentially this trend if it is one, needs to be stopped dead in it's tracks.

[ktmguy]

Some good info.
http://www.linkecu.com/products/InstallationAccessories/can/can-bus-information/at_download/file

[DMacL]

The point about this initiative is lobbying. I'm going to say we have 3000+ members that will see the response and probably several bike magazines as well. We are after all, ready to race, but not towards financial insolvency. We are seeking a technical partnership that encourages third party products to enhance the bike.

I suggest posting something similar over at http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-1290-superduke/board3110-1290-superduke-tuning - they have a few guys who will be racing 1290s this year, and it seems like they have a few more owners than us also.

[kevxtx]

Some good info.
http://www.linkecu.com/products/InstallationAccessories/can/can-bus-information/at_download/file

Good old Self Study Program from Volkswagen, I do have all the latest versions of Flex ray & optical bus.

[jmann]

I suggest posting something similar over at http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-1290-superduke/board3110-1290-superduke-tuning - they have a few guys who will be racing 1290s this year, and it seems like they have a few more owners than us also.

Will do ...

[MrZ32]

Some good info.
http://www.linkecu.com/products/InstallationAccessories/can/can-bus-information/at_download/file

Good old Self Study Program from Volkswagen, I do have all the latest versions of Flex ray & optical bus.

As the head mechanic/technician at volkswagen in bris. .. or is it workshop now? I would hope that you have the latest and greatest gear as well as the skills/knowledge to do so.

[Joe Biker]

i have contacted powercommander and they
are waiting for a bike to develop maps
for the pcv they already have a part number
for the unit

[jmann]

i have contacted powercommander and they
are waiting for a bike to develop maps
for the pcv they already have a part number
for the unit

What does that mean? Have they brought a bike and are waiting for it or are they waiting for somebody to say "here use my bike".
If the latter where are they located and who do we know that has a 1290R nearby - probably nobody, give that it is in the US so the wait could be considerable.

[jmann]

Update on the RFI to KTM.

On the 5th March I wrote to Stefan Pierer on behalf of this forum. I indicated that we were seeking information regarding the interface to the ECU to enable tuning of third party exhausts for racing Etc. I anticipated that he wouldn't address the matter directly but would pass on the request to somebody further down the pecking order. To date I have heard nothing although the request has probably prompted some internal discussion on courses of action. We can only wait and hope that somebody will respond in the near future.

[sexparty]

Just wait for NEO and the Austin Racing group to sort it out and then you'll have what you want soon enough.

First service is nearly due... Then when I order my GP1 next week and install it, if the workshop isn't too busy I'll see if we can dyno it and then get the Akra map loaded into the bike and dyno it again.

I'll also ask about those self cancelling indicators? I'd like that.

[abc]

I suggest posting something similar over at http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-1290-superduke/board3110-1290-superduke-tuning - they have a few guys who will be racing 1290s this year, and it seems like they have a few more owners than us also.[/quote]

Can anyone tell me how I can read the technical pages on this forum. Its all in german and I dont know how to convert everything on their forum.
Thanks heaps.

[DMacL]

I use google's Chrome browser which will translate automatically.

[oczer79]

I suggest posting something similar over at http://www.ktmforum.eu/forum3/wbb/990-1290-superduke/board3110-1290-superduke-tuning - they have a few guys who will be racing 1290s this year, and it seems like they have a few more owners than us also.

Can anyone tell me how I can read the technical pages on this forum. Its all in german and I dont know how to convert everything on their forum.
Thanks heaps.

http://www.google.no/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDMQ7gEwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Ftranslate.google.no%2Ftranslate%3Fhl%3Den%26sl%3Dde%26u%3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.ktmforum.eu%2Fforum3%2Fwbb%2F990-1290-superduke%2Fboard3110-1290-superduke-tuning%2F%26prev%3D%2Fsearch%253Fq%253Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.ktmforum.eu%2Fforum3%2Fwbb%2F990-1290-superduke%2Fboard3110-1290-superduke-tuning%2526client%253Dopera%2526hs%253DMYG%2526channel%253Dsuggest&ei=w0RhU9HFG-Wu4ATpi4GgDA&usg=AFQjCNEE1KGfYYaLdNtGziQTVzw-Na3uaQ&sig2=yHDAdHdVQARj5r_8nc9OmQ&bvm=bv.65636070,d.bGE

[Crotchrockety]

It will be interesting to see what types of gain one gets from a full system versus a slip on. On the Tuono V4's, the difference is negligible. One usually gains only 1-2 HP going to the full system versus the slip on. Not much bang for the buck at all.

[MrZ32]

It will be interesting to see what types of gain one gets from a full system versus a slip on. On the Tuono V4's, the difference is negligible. One usually gains only 1-2 HP going to the full system versus the slip on. Not much bang for the buck at all.

I think most of it will come from the map that ktm supplies with it.. Like purposely De tuning the motor so that when they tune it properly you feel like that 4.5k was worth the money.

Like how they would remove the 2nd and 3rd gear restrictions on the old akra map... so you feel like it is value for money

[NEO]

The ktm supplied full Akra system map.
Tested on dyno with our de cat gp3 and gp1 systems. The map is pretty good giving a 13:1 af reading through the rev range on a full power run.
Slightly varied at certain throttle openings but that will vary bike to bike.

If you have our system our advice is install this map.

We will be testing the pair valve block of kit from ktm soon.

Testing our headers to create a full system in around 4 weeks.